Ever since the Star Wars prequels I've thought story telling gave way to CGI in a major way and we're seeing it more...

Ever since the Star Wars prequels I've thought story telling gave way to CGI in a major way and we're seeing it more and more as bringing fantasy to the big screen has become easier and cheaper through the use of computers. Jurassic Park, Transformers, hell, even mundane non-scifi movies like the Fast and Furious franchise are spending more time hammering out CGI than great stories.

CGI is being used like a crutch in Hollywood, encouraging studios to put out substandard films as long as they can make up for them with a CGI bonanza.

As a reader, a writer and an avid movie goer, the narrative should be paramount in any film or television show. It's the story that sticks with us, that we'll talk about at the water cooler and debate over drinks with friends.
http://variety.com/2015/film/news/avengers-age-of-ultron-cgi-special-effects-1201487125/

Comments

John Hardy said…
Cinema is pretty dead right now. Backward looking and conservative. It will be reborn one day but alas not in this decade.
Rob Gordon said…
You know I have have a bunch of those super hero special effects movies that I have um . - procured on my hard drive right now - with easy hook up to a decent sized screen, and I can''t get in the mood to watch any of them.   If there is not a good story why bother?
Furious 7 jumped the shark with the jump between three buildings in Dubai; so obviously a CGI stunt. Lucas was more into his CGI toybox than his need for cohesive narrative in the prequels. JarJar should have been a cameo; Lucas wanted his fully realized CGI character in half the scenes. Now it's Joss' turn in the Avengers sequel. It needed to be trimmed by about 20 minutes (Hulk vs Hulk-buster should have hit the editing room floor) and additional narrative should have been added to clarify the character's motivations.
John Hardy said…
Superheroes don't have motivations. That's the whole problem with them and the problem for anyone tasked with filming them. Superheroes are just archetypes like Hercules or Apollo, solid and unchanging. They don't want anything or want for anything. Motives are for ordinary mortals and joe averages.
Duke Of Denver said…
This article is nonsense. You might as well say lets go back to riding on horseback because car usage is in overkill. Its called TECHNOLOGY! Don't blame filmakers for not thinking backwards. Without CGI some scenes would be literally impossible to create
John Hardy said…
And possibly shouldn't have been.
Itadakimasu said…
I disagree, the cgi used in any movie has nothing to do with the quality of the actual story. In fact, because of leaps in cgi, movies are getting more visually pleasing scenes and the ideas the writers are trying to convey come out far more accurately when compared to what they had in mind. If you think that the quality of stories/ narrative in a movie has dipped, that's because the writer failed to do so and not because the writer was using CGI as a "clutch". I personally am glad for the advances in cgi as it will allow for more creativity.
Itadakimasu said…
Jesse Heymann thank you!
TooMany Fandoms said…
In a lot of cases you are right they prefer cgi over cariter development, but in Avengers Age of Altron the cgi is needed because we are not yeat capable to Mack a robot that would move in the coret ways and even thou there is allot of cgi it not destrating from the cariters, and there is still cariter development that works. They didn't go down lets us cgi to cover up the fact that are cariters and story sucks, because it didn't. Thow there are some that do that ie Michle Bay's Transforms.
Jason ON said…
David Goldstein, the Fast and Furious franchise jumped the proverbial shark at movie number 5. It just went downhill from there. 

John Hardy didn't vote for Abbott, I disagree. Superheroes do have motivations, they're just not explored very well in AoU. Considering the films only, not the comics, we know from Thor that Thor takes Midgard (Earth) under his protection; Captain America is against tyranny no matter what form it takes; Black Widow is trying to redeem herself from past actions; Iron Man is arrogant and believes he's the only way to save the world; the Hulk is, well, the Hulk; and Hawkeye's motivation is, it's his job. The superhero archetype is the person who does right for the sake of doing right. As the Hindu believe, there are many paths to god. In the superhero realm, there are many paths to 'right.'

Jesse Heymann, this article isn't nonsense, it's asking a question all of us should be asking: is a bad movie with great special effects (these days done with CGI) a good movie? And the answer is no. CGI can make movie "magic" but computer graphics cannot tell a great story in and of themselves. And as more studios rely on CGI we've seen a lack of storytelling in these big summer blockbusters.

ikay abuah, I think you fail to understand what I was saying in my original post. You're right, CGI has nothing to do with the actual story, but CGI cannot replace a bad story.
Duke Of Denver said…
Jason ON​ What do you mean by "rely" on CGI?
If I'm making a King Kong or robot movie, of course I have to rely on CGI. Its part of the movie, like sound, lighting, etc.
But Hollywood thinks that More CGI= Bad movie
There is no lack of good storytelling. But the larger the scale of the project, the more mistakes you are likely to make.
Jason ON said…
Actually, no, Jesse Heymann. If you're making a King Kong or robot movie you don't need to rely on CGI. Believe it or not, they were making King Kong and robot movies long before computers. The original Star Wars trilogy: no CGI. The original Star Treks (TV and movies): no CGI. And so on. As I said in my original post: CGI has become a crutch. Special effects used to have animatronics, wild costume designers, makeup artists, minatures, etc. 

I'm not saying CGI shouldn't be used in films, what I, and the article are saying, is that the story shouldn't be compromised just because you have a large CGI budget.
Duke Of Denver said…
Jason ON​ In this modern era, you do need CGI for those types of movies. Its more cost effective. The CGI scenes are a PART of the storytelling. The problem lies in the way the directors use it, not the CGI technology itself
Jason ON said…
Jesse Heymann, I don't know how old you are or if you passed any sort of reading comprehension program in your school (maybe English isn't your first language) but I already said - twice - that CGI has been used as a crutch for bad storytelling. 

You know what, the more I re-read your most previous post the more I think you just don't understand. I AM NOT, nor is the linked-to article, TALKING ABOUT THE TECHNOLOGY BEHIND CGI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The article, no any of my previous statements, are talking about the technology. No one gives a fuck about the technology behind CGI except for the people selling it, using it or developing it. For this conversation we are talking about the use of CGI, it's rise as a SFX medium and the fall of good storytelling at the same time. Only a fool would think any of the Transformers movies were good movies. Sure, the first one was entertaining, but the rest? Utter BS. The Star Wars prequels, I think we can all agree, were terrible story telling. Man of Steel could have used less CGI, so could any movie that relied on visual effects over great storytelling.

Or let John Pennington say it on Quora:  http://goo.gl/25B6OP

It can contribute to a lack of substance and emotion in writing. Certain movies can become dependant on explosions and supposedly epic scenes which poorly manipulate the art that CGI can be. This can act as a substitute for good quality and thoughtful writing which is often the thing that makes a movie and sadly, which the frequency of CGI use few films manage to get the balance right. Here, CGI annoys people because it is detrimental to the quality of a movies writing content and script which can often destroy a movie entirely. The substitution of CGI over real movie-making technique and emotional, plot driven movies.
Will Munck said…
Jason ON​ .. preach it brother.
Sash Walker said…
If you've ever watched movies from the 1940's, you would see much better storytelling, which is why I've spent most of my movie time on older films. In the 1950's some of the studios went to some pretty silly films. Certainly not ALL films in the early days were deep stories, but so many of them had substantial content. 
All too often I watch a current film (I actually love Disaster Movies!) and I'm so disappointed. 
Sharknado is one perfect example of just a horrible movie plot that depends entirely on CGI, (I'm assuming that was what was used), yet has ironically developed a cult following. That's because it was SO AWFUL!
I watched Gozilla recently and actually liked it. Not the best story, but the special effects blended so well into the story line that it was enjoyable. But hey, I'm old enough to remember the original Godzilla movies, so I knew what to expect.
One of my favorite movies based on plot lines is Double Indemnity with Barbara Stanwyck and Fred MacMurray. That movie had so many twists and built such anticipation, I was on the edge of my seat. 
Films with CGI rarely excite me, so by and large, I avoid them.
Will Munck said…
CGI is like Alcohol:

Used correctly and with at least a decent amount of judgment it can take something good and help boost it into great.

Sitting around in ones basement pounding a fifth of cheap vodka is just sad. . .and that is what a lot of movies seem to be turning into.
Duke Of Denver said…
Jason ON​ Don't group all movies in one basket. There are dramas, romances, action films, epic films etc. Epic films cannot achieve that level of epicness at a lower cost without CGI.
Thats why James Cameron waited decades to shoot Avatar.
The epicness is all part of the storytelling. Some directors do it RIGHT, some do it WRONG. Its their fault, not the CGI tech itself.
Case Study: Dawn of The Planet of Apes v. Transformers: Age of Extinction
Its the director, not the CGI.
Sash Walker said…
Epicness??

Jesse Heymann Hon, this isn't a word.
If CGI were ever necessary, as some here claim, then books would fail.
Jinx Flames said…
Looking through the comments So, we got the side who enjoys cgi and thinks of it as a good thing, then we have the side going insane because they have a cgi robot, cgi action, and cgi sets. Wow. Ok, all I'm going to say on the matter is this. I'd prefer cgi over a stop motion claymation or, god help me, a puppet any day.
Jinx Flames The point is that CGI, stop-motion, or even puppets are irrelevant if the story sucks to begin with.

Look at Michael Bay, or (BLASPHEMY?!) Peter Jackson. He butchered the Lord of the Rings with putting his special effects over the story. I actually fell asleep during The Two Towers, the battle scene was SO BORING.

But then, I am one of those people who doesn't think that there is anything Star Wars beyond the first movie in 1977.
nora glora said…
I saw this sequel, & there was nothing new there, apart from more action , noise & cgi .Avengers seem to go in the same vicious cycle of effects & characters.
Jason ON said…
brun a barbarian gets what I'm trying to say. It's not that CGI is bad, it's that Hollywood seems more intent on shoving CGI down our throats at the expense of good story telling.
John Hardy said…
Jason ON​​ agreed about their official attributes and goals. I'm just not convinced by any of them. Give an ordinary person super abilities and you not going to get too many heroes that way. In other words the premise of superheroes is largely flawed and shares more in common with theology than actual drama.

And then you have inept handling by script writers. Re: Black Widow and awesome women in general.
Rob Gordon said…
That is why I like "Watchmen" - none of them really had superpowers and they were all so neurotic.
John Hardy said…
Yes the Watchmen. Excellent stuff.
Jason ON said…
There are always going to be good guys and bad guys, people who take advantage of others and people who help others. It's the human way. This also applies to people with "super powers." Just like there are rich people who screw people over and there are rich people who use their wealth for positive affect.

As for Black Widow: she has been portrayed fine in every movie she's been in, especially Winter Soldier. I will agree that women haven't been well represented in the superhero movie genre, but let's face it: these hero movies are made about men, from comic books about men from a time when only young men read comic books. They're covering origins and popular storylines, most of which involve men in the roles of good guys and bad guys. Marvel, specifically, has very little in the way of powerful women they can choose from having licensed off most of their top tier characters to different studios and that's why we're seeing a lot of background characters suddenly thrown into the forefront of the cinematic universe. DC has one superheroine that I can think of that has curb appeal and have yet been able to bring her to the big screen. They tried with the small screen but failed miserably.

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