I had a woman here on G+ who tried to tell me women wouldn't lie about rape.
I had a woman here on G+ who tried to tell me women wouldn't lie about rape. We argued back and forth and she finally just started calling me names like "misogynist" and blocked me.
The truth is, I've seen it. Not me, thank all the gods, but an acquaintance of mine a long time ago. After being questioned by the police she admitted she lied because they slept together and he never called. She was looking for a way to get back at him.
Lies ruin lives. They can ruin marriages, careers and send people to jail for crimes they didn't commit.
http://theblackmancan.org/positive-black-male-news-brian-banks-spent-five-years-in-prison-after-being-falsely-accused-of-rape-but-now-he-finally-has-a-career-in-nfl/
The truth is, I've seen it. Not me, thank all the gods, but an acquaintance of mine a long time ago. After being questioned by the police she admitted she lied because they slept together and he never called. She was looking for a way to get back at him.
Lies ruin lives. They can ruin marriages, careers and send people to jail for crimes they didn't commit.
http://theblackmancan.org/positive-black-male-news-brian-banks-spent-five-years-in-prison-after-being-falsely-accused-of-rape-but-now-he-finally-has-a-career-in-nfl/
Comments
(42 because that's the right number for lots of things)
To blow it up out of proportion is silly. And women who lied about rape should go to jail, just like another other fraud cases.
That's because the general cost for a woman to accuse a man, no matter if it's true or not, is so high that very few do it for a lark.
I think the innocent man would disagree.
I think women that lie are deplorable and should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But to let rapists walk as long as they don't leave bruises or video evidence is basically saying your word is not worth that of a man. And we convict innocent people for all sorts of crime. If we followed a similar policy to make sure no innocent people went to prison we'd let most people go free.
The way we do it now where a jury listens to all evidence available and then decides who they believe isn't 100%, but our justice system isn't 100%. And saying that it always needs to be right in this one area and only this one area is a "fuck you" to women.
I'm just saying women do lie about it too.
Then people ( often Feminists ) are confusing and conflating 2 different groups : (1) People who have been raped , (2)and people who haven't ,
but pretend ( for many reasons, including the desire to inflict violence. But also guilt, shame, embarrassment and revenge on an X ).
And Sometimes its just the wrong suspect.
Most Actual Rapes , are not reported
So Kayci Morgan what you said about 92% includes non-reported rapes.
A fake rape claimaint doesn't face being retraumatized by the reporting. Unfortunately due to trauma , the Stigmas will effect rape survivors more than the liars.
Rape Survivors are often afraid of their Assailants ( for good reason ), while fake claimants make phony claims because they are not afraid of who they accuse.
8% doesn't seem like a lot, until you add numbers to it.
But if it doubles or trebles ( as a percentage of reported to police percentages ) that's now 16-24% !
Then factor in, that a conviction for a false rape claim will often come with being raped in prison.
We all know how common that is in the US.
Basically , If the person is a close friend or family member you should support them.
If the Accused Assailant is Bill Cosby, you should support the Survivor.
False Rape Claims do destroy lives. If we create a Public Myth of a Never-Lying-Accuser , or Gender-that-never-lies, it will empower the false-accusers. They will increase.
Same thing for zero I consequences for fraudulent claims.
< The National Organization for Women is still publicly supporting the Rolling Stone Claimant in Law Suits. *>*
If we were to take into account unreported rapes, which in some cases can be 3X or 4X of reported ones, the incidents of false rape accusation drops even further.
It isn't even 1 rape per rapist. Most rapists are serial rapists;
So you can't say things like "its a 92% chance that an accused is guilty." A man is unlikely to face multiple false accusations.
The best thing we can do to help prosecute rape is actually Do the Damn DNA tests. And Institutionalize The Innocence Project as part of Quality Control in our Justice System . ( to free the innocent )
Its outrageous that there is 20 year backlogs, of DNA rape kits.
Catching serial rapists , who ought to have been stopped decades ago, will have the most social impact. We all should be outraged this is allowed to go on.
http://www.npr.org/2016/01/17/463358406/whats-being-done-to-address-the-countrys-backlog-of-untested-rape-kits?utm_content=bufferb4802&utm_medium=social&utm_source=plus.google.com&utm_campaign=buffer
Make sure that if the alleged victims if PROVEN to have lied (no sexual intercourse took place, no DNA, confession of lie, alibi, video footage) get lengthy jail sentences. This would help the real victims.
I get that men live in fear that one day a woman might lie on them and destroy their lives. I understand that. How hard is it to see that women live in fear too. That rape destroys lives too. And on top of being raped they'll get to go through the humiliation of being treated like a lying slut because it makes people feel better to think those kinds of things don't happen in our society.
And don't throw "feminist" at me like a slur. I'm assuming you mean I believe in female supremacy which I don't. And notice how while you can bring up that men are raped most in the US, we aren't discussing how men destroy men's lives by raping them in prison, which happens way, way, way more than a woman lying about rape. But the only time I ever see men concerned with the rape of other men is when they are belittling the experiences of women.
No, this is falsehood.
They are usually not done at all. Its a major scandal I posted links above. This is a double-scandal as it would find serial rapists and free innocent people!
Do you have sociological evidence for this scientific claim. It ought to exist if true. If not its just your opinion and may not be borne out in fact.
IT sounds like you are unhappy the Court system doesn't work as Guilty until proven Innocent. What you are suggesting requires a constitutional amendment which I would oppose out conscience. We would have to switch to the Interrogatory system where you hold pretrial which gather evidence, like an Expanded Grand-jury system wuth broad police-powers ...an Inquisition.
"because as stated so eloquently above "women lie". "
Except they do.
Women do lie. Because they are human beings , not Saintly imaginary Blessed creatures. All women lie, all men lie. and when they ( humans ) are even trying to tell the truth, they minds are filled with cognitive biases and their memories are easily manipulated to crates false memories and ,bogus testimony.
Sociopaths and Narcissists come in both flavors of human:male and female.
If you havent met them both , up close and personal , then you are either a a very lucky or sheltered person; I have.
Feminists backed the insane rightwong bullshit witch hunts in the 1980s claiming "satanic ritual abuse" and "daycare care abuse" . Thats what the "Victims cant lie" narrative crates.
IT creates new victims. It creates Dead bodies and destroys lives. The victims are often not men. ITs women.
The Women-cant-lie meme was surely active in Salem Ma and every other witch-burning. Crazy idea, we appeal to science and verifiable evidence about the accuracy of human testimony. We dont create a class of magic victims whos minds cant make errors.
"Even though in most cases they aren't."
Except you are invoking a fallacy of ambiguity. "most Cases" actually presumes a match between victim number, accusser number , accused and perpetrator. These are all separate sets of statistics , and they dont all match. The simple proof of this is that most rapes are perpetrated by serial rapists. Are most accused serial accused? no. So we know there is a mismatch right there.
Furthermore, the reliability of victim testimonies does NOT depend on believing it. Thats is what you are implying.
Unfortunately the evidence points to the other direction. Victim testimony is only as reliable as it is, because we are skeptical about it. If we do as some feminists demand, and simply make the courts believe all testimony automatically, It will make Victim Testimony wildly unreliable and encourage false -claims.
If its someone you know you support them unconditionally. But in a Post-gamergate world , one where distributed social media harassment is a real and ever-present danger ( I am assuming that you , like me, are against this ) we cant prosecute all rumors we hear on the internet .
Is that what you intended that to read? The stigma for male rape is even higher . There are almost no prosecutions. There is no public support. Its unlikely the small amount of men facing triple stigmas to go public is lying.
For the ladies i would argue this is also true in highly conservative religious societies , ( where women are likely to get blamed or treated as property )
As for all those people arguing innocent until proven guilty answer me this, if your babysitter was charged with molesting three little girls would you still leave him with your five year old daughter? That's basically what's being advocated, that he be treated absolutely no different until he's been convicted regardless of how much evidence they have against him. So unless you can say, "Yes, he could keep his job babysitting my daughter" none of you truly believe in innocent until proven guilty.
You read my comment before I first edited it. It had a Typo that I immediately fixed . TLDR; Fuck Bill Cosby. He's the Country's most notorious serial rapist.
I said the opposite of what you thought. I.e. That Cosby's Victims should unambiguously be believed.
( because fuck Bill Cosby )
Cosby is independently corroborated as a serial rapist by multiple lines of evidence.
Do I really think that Cosby raped 40 Women? Of course not, I think he raped 200-300 . Don't you think that sounds more accurate?
Of Course, this doesn't mean that every single one of Cosby's accusers are one of these 200 + Rape Survivors.
As the Stigma disintegrates against taking down Cosby I would expect more fake reports to get added--- Because these are two different populations of people: Survivors and Accusers. Yes, they overlap. But non-survivor Accusers ( liars ) don't risk personal trauma in coming out. We can agree on that too, I am sure.
So even though I believe Cosby raped over 200 women, ( far above the evidence, but in line with the science of non reported rape ) , I can freely admit he could eventually have 30-40 fake claimants.
( with Cosby who knows really. This story is ongoing. Its tabloid news for a decade )
If we go by your 92% that would mean 16 fake claimants. Do you see the problem, the fakers rise to the top.
But at this point I wouldn't really care 85% of Cosby's accusers are liars. He's still guilty as hell.
& Trump is a rapist too.
I'm quoting you. Cut-and-paste
You said: "... the point is that ALL alleged rape victims get full access to rape kits and these are processed quickly and accurately."
Thats your words, cut and paste.
It totally wrong. Dont complain to me. You are the one who wrote it. Edit it so it so it Not-crazy-wrong.
Take care. Enjoy the thread.